Improving Ethnic Minority Representation in a Reformed Second Chamber
12 October 1999. Held at the Catalyst Trust, London. Seminar notes 2.

In attendance: Roy Hattersley (Chair, Catalyst Editorial Board); Lord Meghnad Desai; Simon Woolley (Operation Black Vote); Sadiq Khan (Christian Fisher Solicitors); Sanjay Verdi (UNISON); Michael Wheeler-Booth (Royal Commission); Dr Richard Stone; Ben Jackson (Catalyst); Dave Timms (Catalyst); Barbara Gunnell (Director of Catalyst); Barbara Cohen (CRE); Baroness Uddin; Geetha Guru-Murthy (BBC News); David Leam (TGWU); Amanda Day (Tribune).

The seminar opened with presentations from Meghnad Desai, Simon Woolley and Richard Stone.

Lord Desai expected any reform of the Lords to be incomplete, since it appears that the Prime Minister favours an appointed second chamber. In Meghnad Desaiís view, this would be a missed opportunity, and very damaging, since the Lords does not lack legitimacy because it is constituted upon a hereditary basis, but because it is unelected. Reform is needed because the British constitution is therefore effectively unicameral. Nonetheless, one excuse given for favouring appointment is that an appointed chamber would yield greater representation for ethnic minorities. Meghnad Desai believed that this was a shocking argument, which condoned current selection procedures for candidates for the House of Commons and said something deeply worrying about the British constitution. However, Meghnad Desai was clear that despite these misgivings, the reformed second chamber will be an appointed one. The question we therefore must address is whether there are good or bad ways of securing ethnic minority representation through a system of appointments. This raises fundamental issues of principle for the British constitution: do we now wish to follow the example of the constitutions of former British colonies, which favour a picture of society as made up of different groups, rather than the predominantly individualistic model followed by Britain. The danger of this group theory is that we require a coherent definition of who counts as a member of an ethnic minority. In Meghnad Desaiís opinion, this is an extremely dangerous trap that ethnic minority groups are being asked to enter, and they must be very cautious.

Simon Woolley argued that the language of the debate about constitutional reform can often be alienating, and can exclude many groups from the discussion. He felt it was important to continually remind people that constitutional reform aims to give ordinary people a greater say over their lives. Instead, current debates about the constitution are presented as squabbles about power. Black people in Britain have little reason to be enthused about constitutional change when the Welsh Assembly and Scottish Parliament have no ethnic minority representatives. The selection of candidates for the GLA was expected to produce 10-12 GLA members from ethnic minorities, but instead we will be lucky to see 2. Simon Woolley was extremely pessimistic about any proposed reforms to the Lords yielding better ethnic minority representation than in these cases, and he regretted the governmentís decision to use the concerns of the black community as a justification for constructing a wholly nominated second chamber. The considerable power at the disposal of the central party machines should be used to ensure ethnic minority candidates are selected for winnable seats, rather than to select appointees. Simon felt that party machines should be both encouraging good ethnic minority candidates to put themselves forward, and exerting pressure upon constituencies to select them. On this point, it was suggested that the GLA selection procedure in the Labour Party had tried to create a climate where ethnic minority candidates would be selected: many capable candidates were placed on the panel and each selection meeting had a statement read to it, stressing the need for candidates from currently under-represented groups. Despite this, few ethnic minority candidates were ultimately selected for winnable seats. Simon replied that he felt that the party machine should take more positive action, including short lists made up of a majority from ethnic minority groups.

Richard Stone detected deep cynicism and anger from the black community on this topic, similar to the feelings he encountered while serving on the committee of the Stephen Lawrence Inquiry. When composing that report, each of the members of the committee arrived at the same conclusion: that ethnic minorities were the victims of institutional racism, not just individual failures. Richard stated that he had only recently come to appreciate the significance of reform of the Lords for ethnic minorities. To some extent, he argued, patronage has worked for these communities under Labour, with the creation of several new Asian peers. Nonetheless, further progress is needed, since currently representatives in the second chamber are unable to empathise with the lives of those at the bottom of society, and huge amounts of talent in minority communities is being wasted. How to achieve further progress remains difficult. Appointment has worked under this government, but there is no guarantee that future governments will follow a similar pattern. Elections present other difficulties: with party machines in charge, we can easily end up with the GLA situation. Richard Stone concluded by arguing that the best way forward for greater ethnic minority representation is the path successfully followed by the Labour Womenís Network, where mentoring and training schemes helped to bring through a generation of capable female politicians. This is the key to success, regardless of whatever scheme is announced for the new second chamber.

Discussion began by reviewing the submission to the Royal Commission by the Commission for Racial Equality. This evidence started from the premise that appointment has in practice delivered far better representation for ethnic minorities than election. 16% of independent members on Police Commissions are from ethnic minority groups. In local authorities, only 3% of Councillors are from minorities. The CRE therefore proposed that a national appointment board should nominate members of the new second chamber from the various different interests across the nation: from business, science and so on. Within these categories, members of minority groups with special expertise in these areas should be prioritised. This scheme has the advantage of appointing members from minority groups on the basis of their expert status rather than purely because they come from previously under-represented backgrounds.

The point was made that discussions about possible schemes to improve representation in the second chamber depend largely upon the powers given to that chamber. The experience of many minority groups, it was suggested, is that the greater the powers that a body wields, the harder it becomes to secure adequate representation for those who are disenfranchised. A broader programme of change is needed to deal with this problem, and reform of the Lord has to be viewed in this context. Two particular concerns were raised in relation to this: first, there are many smaller ethnic groups that currently do not have any representation whatsoever, including Somalis, Turks etc. These groups have to be included in the process. Secondly, with reference to the Labour Party, internal minority representatives have not been particularly active. The Black Socialist Society has not met for a year, for instance. Some contributors expressed reservations about such groups, fearing that they end up only as vehicles for the metropolitan elite. A better strategy might be to politicise grass roots communities, but this is easier said than done and has to confront considerable cultural obstacles. It was pointed out that these views raise difficult questions about our conception of democracy, and the extent to which we view society as constituted by individuals or by groups. Furthermore, such discussions can risk adopting a homogenous view of minority groups. After all, representatives from minority groups should not simply focus upon the concerns of ethnic minorities.

The discussion then moved on to a proposed model of reform suggested by Billy Bragg. This proposal would distribute seats in the second chamber in proportion to a partyís votes in the general election. Members of the second chamber would be appointed from national party lists, but the ethnic and gender composition of party lists could be specified in legislation. It was objected that the limitation of the length of nomination to the House to electoral terms could act as a disincentive to potential, high calibre candidates who might want a guarantee of longer membership. Others felt that this was an advantage, since the current life sentence may also be a disincentive. A high turnover might help to increase legitimacy, although it was also suggested that tieing the second chamber too closely to the electoral cycle might have disadvantages, whereas a statutory time limit might be more effective at securing fresh members.

A more fundamental problem was then raised by one contributor, who feared that the attempt to deal with reform of the Lords in isolation ignored the more systemic nature of constitutional issues. The danger might be that we would concentrate on designing a second chamber that would be more effective at correcting the mistakes of the Commons, but in the process ignore the more fundamental question of how to stop the Commons making the mistakes in the first place. Unfortunately, it was argued, we are now backed into a corner, and have no way of talking about these more systemic concerns.

The seminar concluded with each of the participants outlining the reforms that they felt should be included in the forthcoming Royal Commission report. Suggestions included the setting of percentage targets for minority representation; the inclusion of a component of the upper house decided by a jury system; an ethnic minority representation target that actually exceeds the share of the population from minority groups; and a comprehensive programme of political and citizenship education. Underlying these ideas, it was emphasised, was the deep sense of frustration and disillusion indicated earlier. It was this sense of disenfranchisement that reform of the Lords and other constitutional changes had to address.

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